Trying to fix bad FPV signal

[watcan]

I have a budget quad with 5-inch propellers that I built to start learning how to race FPV quads, but my current FPV setup is terrible, the video cuts out completely when I fly 15 feet away or even closer when I fly behind myself (And I am just in a grass field). my googles are the Eachine 006 which supposedly has diversity. and have a cheap 18$ indoor FPV cam with built-in 4-leaf clover antenna. I want to upgrade my setup but I don't know if the problem is with my VTX alone or if I need better FPV goggles. I am on a budget so hopefully, I can just upgrade to a better cam and VTX, there is one that looks pretty good on Amazon for 35$ that I am thinking about getting if it solves my problem (Amazon link below)

Amazon.com: AKK KC02 600mW FPV Transmitter with 600TVL 2.8MM 120 Degree High Picture Quality Sony CCD Camera for FPV Multicopter : Electronics

Buy AKK KC02 600mW FPV Transmitter with 600TVL 2.8MM 120 Degree High Picture Quality Sony CCD Camera for FPV Multicopter: Quadcopter Camera Mounts - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases

www.amazon.com

But I don't know enough about this to know if it will fix my problem, I don't know if my goggles are too cheap for what I want them to do or if there is something else I am missing. I just want good enough range to learn to race FPV and do some freestyling. I would appreciate any advice.

 

[tevek]

The first thing I would check is that you have matching polarised antennas. Most people run RHCP antennas (right hand circular polarised) and you generally can get them as a matched set for about $25 and the style is either of the clover leaf or pagoda style as well as others. If you have the original straight linear style antenna fitted to the goggles, chuck them in the bin to give yourself a chance at improving your signal strength. The other problem may be the camera either not producing enough power to transmit any sort of reasonable distance and again not matched to the set up on the goggles or it’s crap to begin with.
There are many camera options out there that will vastly improve your experience, including the one you have posted. 600mW will certainly provide plenty of range but again needs to be set up with the correct antenna. Depending on your budget, maybe look at better goggles at the same time. This is the trouble with this hobby, you need to spend money up front with goggles and a quality controller to make any headway, can’t see = can’t fly.

 

[rtkDarling]

The antennas are key as Tevek said, another thing you can take a look at is the channel that your VTX is transmitting on. The autosearch function on the goggles can tune into the wrong channel and it still looks like you've got signal, but it dies quickly like you're describing.

I've dealt with cheaper VTX that I didn't know how to find out the frequency it's transmitting on. What I did was plug the quad in and leave it on the table, then start walking out of the house. When the signal starts to break up, do another autosearch. As you get farther away the goggles should stop tuning in to the bleed and land on the correct channel.
Not how the pros do it, but it's something you can try without buying anything

 

[watcan]

The first thing I would check is that you have matching polarised antennas. Most people run RHCP antennas (right hand circular polarised) and you generally can get them as a matched set for about $25 and the style is either of the clover leaf or pagoda style as well as others. If you have the original straight linear style antenna fitted to the goggles, chuck them in the bin to give yourself a chance at improving your signal strength. The other problem may be the camera either not producing enough power to transmit any sort of reasonable distance and again not matched to the set up on the goggles or it’s crap to begin with.
There are many camera options out there that will vastly improve your experience, including the one you have posted. 600mW will certainly provide plenty of range but again needs to be set up with the correct antenna. Depending on your budget, maybe look at better goggles at the same time. This is the trouble with this hobby, you need to spend money up front with goggles and a quality controller to make any headway, can’t see = can’t fly.

Thank you Tevek, my goggles came with a Clover Antenna
and a Panel Antenna so I assumed I was good on antennas, but I didn't know about matching polarised antennas so I will have to get a pair, thank you for letting me know the one I found on Amazon would help, I was really unsure if I should get it or find something different. my goggles where around 30$ on sale, so when I look at upgrading them what is a good price range for me to find goggles, is it reasonable for me to look for a decent pair for under 100$ I know there are a few options like, DIY box goggles, upgrading my current goggles by adding an FPV receiver and plugging it into the AV, a receiver like this FR632 Diversity 5.8GHz 48Ch Auto Scan LCD A/V FPV Receiver
and just buy pair of FPV goggles, my VR 006 goggles where geared towards indoor micro quad fpv but the VR 007 look like they are geared more towards racing US$45.99 % Eachine VR-007 Pro VR007 5.8G 40CH FPV Goggles 4.3 Inch With 3.7V 1600mAh Battery for RC Drone RC Parts from Toys Hobbies and Robot on banggood.com but I am not sure if they are a good option, the Eachine EV800D are around 90$ they look good but they are a bit more expensive, but if it makes a huge difference than it is worth it US$89.99 10% Eachine EV800D 5.8G 40CH Diversity FPV Goggles 5 Inch 800*480 Video Headset HD DVR Build in Battery RC Parts from Toys Hobbies and Robot on banggood.com but I am not sure if any of these are good options, hopefully, it is reasonable to get something good for under 100$ I am just not sure what is my best bet. if I really just need to wait and get more expensive goggles later on than I would like to know so that I don't just wast money on junk. thanks, all of your advice has been really helpful.

 

[watcan]

The antennas are key as Tevek said, another thing you can take a look at is the channel that your VTX is transmitting on. The autosearch function on the goggles can tune into the wrong channel and it still looks like you've got signal, but it dies quickly like you're describing.

I've dealt with cheaper VTX that I didn't know how to find out the frequency it's transmitting on. What I did was plug the quad in and leave it on the table, then start walking out of the house. When the signal starts to break up, do another autosearch. As you get farther away the goggles should stop tuning in to the bleed and land on the correct channel.
Not how the pros do it, but it's something you can try without buying anything

Thank you RtkDarling. I do use autosearch because it is easy and I haven't ever figured out to get the channel that my cheap vtx is using, so this is very helpful, I will have to try this as soon as I get back in town, this is great I can try this without spending any money and see if it helps my signal!

 

[rtkDarling]

BTW, I still fly with the EV800D after a few years, but I'm looking to upgrade soon. They're pretty much the cheapest goggles worth getting. Most people are using something that's $300 - $550+ Your goggles and controller are very important. A simple failure from either one can result in losing your craft, so investing a little extra there makes sense in the long run

Can you post a picture of the video antenna on your quad? I bet it's a dipole, and that might be part of your problem too.

 

[watcan]

BTW, I still fly with the EV800D after a few years, but I'm looking to upgrade soon. They're pretty much the cheapest goggles worth getting. Most people are using something that's $300 - $550+ Your goggles and controller are very important. A simple failure from either one can result in losing your craft, so investing a little extra there makes sense in the long run

Can you post a picture of the video antenna on your quad? I bet it's a dipole, and that might be part of your problem too.

it is definitely not the best setup but it is a 4 leaf clover, it is just zip tied to the frame. the antenna is tilted almost 90 degrees backward, I am not sure if that is a problem since from what I know clover antennas are 360-degree coverage but it was the only way I could fit it in the frame.
that is good to know the EV800D is a good pair of goggles that I could use for a while to come. I will have to save up for them.

 

[tevek]

Thank you Tevek, my goggles came with a Clover Antenna
and a Panel Antenna so I assumed I was good on antennas, but I didn't know about matching polarised antennas so I will have to get a pair, thank you for letting me know the one I found on Amazon would help, I was really unsure if I should get it or find something different. my goggles where around 30$ on sale, so when I look at upgrading them what is a good price range for me to find goggles, is it reasonable for me to look for a decent pair for under 100$ I know there are a few options like, DIY box goggles, upgrading my current goggles by adding an FPV receiver and plugging it into the AV, a receiver like this FR632 Diversity 5.8GHz 48Ch Auto Scan LCD A/V FPV Receiver
and just buy pair of FPV goggles, my VR 006 goggles where geared towards indoor micro quad fpv but the VR 007 look like they are geared more towards racing US$45.99 % Eachine VR-007 Pro VR007 5.8G 40CH FPV Goggles 4.3 Inch With 3.7V 1600mAh Battery for RC Drone RC Parts from Toys Hobbies and Robot on banggood.com but I am not sure if they are a good option, the Eachine EV800D are around 90$ they look good but they are a bit more expensive, but if it makes a huge difference than it is worth it US$89.99 10% Eachine EV800D 5.8G 40CH Diversity FPV Goggles 5 Inch 800*480 Video Headset HD DVR Build in Battery RC Parts from Toys Hobbies and Robot on banggood.com but I am not sure if any of these are good options, hopefully, it is reasonable to get something good for under 100$ I am just not sure what is my best bet. if I really just need to wait and get more expensive goggles later on than I would like to know so that I don't just wast money on junk. thanks, all of your advice has been really helpful.

Pleased that you are considering upgrading your kit. As @rtkDarling pointed out, the investment is with the goggles and controller. I have a set of fat shark V3 goggles fitted with a True D diversity module and that coupled with my Taranis Tx turned the whole show around. I wasted money on cheaper stuff that clearly was underwhelming whereas if I’d just stumped up the initial outlay, I would actually be in front. I’m running 6 different quads with the same setup and it never lets me down. As for cheaper alternatives the EV 800D gets a good wrap from many here and is certainly worth considering, probably find a good second hand set either on this forum or your local classifieds. I have a brand new VR 007 set of goggles that never worked for my eyes that you could have for nothing if you were close enough.

 

[tevek]

it is definitely not the best setup but it is a 4 leaf clover, it is just zip tied to the frame. the antenna is tilted almost 90 degrees backward, I am not sure if that is a problem since from what I know clover antennas are 360-degree coverage but it was the only way I could fit it in the frame.
that is good to know the EV800D is a good pair of goggles that I could use for a while to come. I will have to save up for them.View attachment 3316

Hmm, need to either get the antenna outside of the frame or relocate the camera setup to the top of the quad so your signal is not dispersed amongst the carbon and mounting posts. That is going to be a major cause of your problems. Poor little guy is probably working it’s ring out.....

 

[watcan]

Pleased that you are considering upgrading your kit. As @rtkDarling pointed out, the investment is with the goggles and controller. I have a set of fat shark V3 goggles fitted with a True D diversity module and that coupled with my Taranis Tx turned the whole show around. I wasted money on cheaper stuff that clearly was underwhelming whereas if I’d just stumped up the initial outlay, I would actually be in front. I’m running 6 different quads with the same setup and it never lets me down. As for cheaper alternatives the EV 800D gets a good wrap from many here and is certainly worth considering, probably find a good second hand set either on this forum or your local classifieds. I have a brand new VR 007 set of goggles that never worked for my eyes that you could have for nothing if you were close enough.

Thank you, I appreciate your advice, it is very helpful. I would definitely take you up on your offer if I didn't live on the other side of the world, but I am glad I know how I can improve my signal. I don't think it will be very hard now.

 

[tevek]

Thank you, I appreciate your advice, it is very helpful. I would definitely take you up on your offer if I didn't live on the other side of the world, but I am glad I know how I can improve my signal. I don't think it will be very hard now.

Best part is that you’re asking questions of people on this forum that have ‘been there done that’. You’ll get there and have a lot of fun doing so. We all had to start somewhere...

 

[rtkDarling]

Yeah, I agree that's your problem. You want that antenna out farther from the frame/electronics. Those cam/vtx combos are better for micros. Tuning to the right cannel may help, but even with new goggles you're not going to get much range out of that. You can get a cam and a vtx for about $40 total.

This will give the guys a laugh. Long story short I needed a new antenna and only had one extender that's too long. Now, instead of a stub, I've got a ridiculous tail.
Get's good reception though

 

[watcan]

Yeah, I agree that's your problem. You want that antenna out farther from the frame/electronics. Those cam/vtx combos are better for micros. Tuning to the right cannel may help, but even with new goggles you're not going to get much range out of that. You can get a cam and a vtx for about $40 total.

This will give the guys a laugh. Long story short I needed a new antenna and only had one extender that's too long. Now, instead of a stub, I've got a ridiculous tail.
Get's good reception though

View attachment 3317

Haha, that's great, have you caught the antenna on anything when flying?

I have been looking around I think I am going to use a foxeer camera US$25.99 % Foxeer HS1177 V2 600TVL CCD 2.5mm/2.8mm PAL/NTSC IR Blocked Mini FPV Camera 5-40V w/ Bracket RC Parts from Toys Hobbies and Robot on banggood.com with an eachine VTX US$12.50 64% Eachine TX5258 5.8G 72CH 25/200/500/800mW Switchable FPV Transmitter Support OSD Configuring Smartaudio RC Parts from Toys Hobbies and Robot on banggood.com and then get a foxeer antenna US$15.90 20% 2pcs Foxeer 5.8G Lollipop 3 2.5DBi Omni FPV Antenna RHCP SMA/RP-SMA for RC Drone RC Parts from Toys Hobbies and Robot on banggood.com I think this will be a setup that will further proof my quad because it seems like it is a pretty good and has a microphone. so that when I do upgrade my goggles I can use those features. I have never wired up a VTX and camera since the last one I had just needed me to plug in 5 volts.it looks like the VTX might just be able to plug into the camera but if it cant I think I will just connect power then connect the yellow wire on the cam to the yellow wire on the VTX. then that just leaves the green wire on the VTX, do I need to do anything with the green wire to send audio?

This setup is a little more money, but I think I will just put off new goggles and motors for a little and do the FPV setup right the first time.

 

[rtkDarling]

That VTX is going to run on Vbat (that's full power)
Red wire to vbat, black to ground. The yellow goes to the video out pin on your FC, and the green goes to a free UART for smart audio control. This isn't an audio line for sound, "Smart audio" is for controlling your VTX from your FC. You don't need it to fly.

The camera runs on 5 volts, Red is 5v, black is ground, yellow goes to "video in" on the FC, and the final wire is cam control (just like smart audio for the VTX it's convenient, but not necessary)

 

[watcan]

That VTX is going to run on Vbat (that's full power)
Red wire to vbat, black to ground. The yellow goes to the video out pin on your FC, and the green goes to a free UART for smart audio control. This isn't an audio line for sound, "Smart audio" is for controlling your VTX from your FC. You don't need it to fly.

The camera runs on 5 volts, Red is 5v, black is ground, yellow goes to "video in" on the FC, and the final wire is cam control (just like smart audio for the VTX it's convenient, but not necessary)

I don't see a video in and out, I don't think my FC has one. I could be wrong I am still kinda new to this stuff.

Ok, I think I understand smart audio now, I am more interested in being able to hear what my quad hears (which is mostly motor and propellors spinning) dose my VTX automatically send that? can I wire my VTX red to Vbat or I do have a 12-volt pad on my PDB that I could wire my VTX to, from what I have heard connecting directly to battery voltage can create transmission noise, black to ground yellow to yellow on camera. and then camera red to 5V and camera black to ground. would this work? or is there a better way?

 

[rtkDarling]

You're right, your FC doesn't have an On screen display, so there's no camera in. Unless you get a dedicated OSD board you'll connect the yellow video out from the camera to the yellow video in on the VTX. You'll probably power the camera off the 5v out on the VTX as well because I don't see a 5v out on the board.

I imagine that without a capacitor you're going to get some video noise just because it looks like an older FC board

 

[watcan]

You're right, your FC doesn't have an On screen display, so there's no camera in. Unless you get a dedicated OSD board you'll connect the yellow video out from the camera to the yellow video in on the VTX. You'll probably power the camera off the 5v out on the VTX as well because I don't see a 5v out on the board.

I imagine that without a capacitor you're going to get some video noise just because it looks like an older FC board

I have a dedicated PDB with 12V out which I will use for the VTX. thanks for the help! I think the foxeer camera will be worth the upgrade.